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PosSol in talks to recruit 40 ex-Lloyds and RBS advisers

by Jun Merrett on Nov 28, 2012 at 11:00

PosSol in talks to recruit 40 ex-Lloyds and RBS advisers

Aegon-owned national IFA Positive Solutions is in talks to recruit 40 ex-bank advisers from Lloyds, Royal Bank of Scotland (RBS) and NatWest.

PosSol chief executive Peter Coleman (pictured) said the firm wanted to take advantage of the banks’ recent decisions to withdraw their branch advisers for mass-market clients.

In June, RBS announced it would cut 600 advice roles, closing its IFA arm but retaining a restricted service.

In September, Lloyds revoked previous plans to have a face-to-face service for the mass market, and instead announced it would only offer advice to clients with more than £100,000 to invest.

Coleman said: ‘It’s nice to offer a home to advisers who would otherwise be without one. We’re looking for high-quality advisers that are trained well with an entrepreneurial ability and who can be successful IFAs.’

31 comments so far. Why not have your say?

Sceptic via mobile

Nov 28, 2012 at 11:49

Another big mistake from Possol - what happens when the banks hold the advisers to their restrictive covenants, the advisers will be tossed out of the door, will Possol then need another bail out??

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Andrew Goodwin - Truly Independent Ltd

Nov 28, 2012 at 11:56

Advisers from RBS,HBoS, Nat West and Santander are joining us too, but so too are unhappy Advisers from PS.

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Hickky

Nov 28, 2012 at 12:08

Pos Sol cannot expect these new advisers to contact clients they have dealt with. The Data Protection Act will be invoked as well as restrictive covenants. Expect a robust defense of the bank's right to their clients, even if they have given up giving advice, they still want the investment renewal income, and will try to scare ex advisers by any means they can.

Time to go to court to see if any defense by the banks' t&c's treats customers fairly!

PosSol, over to you.

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Gerry Cooper

Nov 28, 2012 at 12:11

The desparate, despairing but doomed fight for survival by the networks - That's what you're seeing here.

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Gee via mobile

Nov 28, 2012 at 12:16

With the huge numbers that have left the banks I can't see the banks making a big noise if clients are poached, that's even if their systems are sophisticated enough to spot it. They sold policies, they had no meaningful relationship with the clients. They might aim to make an example of someone with a test case. Good luck to them, fill yer boots.

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Smithling

Nov 28, 2012 at 12:16

Sceptic - I think you are giving the banks far far too much credit.

Bancassurance is designed for one sale business. No after care or consultation. It's to invest the life savings, charge 5% initial and 3% AMC and move on to the next one. You have advisers who are watched by Regional sales advisers who care about one thing and one thing only which is the sales figures. The only area they remotely care about is compliance and even then it's only to a "get it through" stage, not because they care about the client/customer. The first hint that the banks would get is a slight fluctuation in the retention rates as an adviser leaves with all his/her clients and they notice some clawback. As for actually identifying the clients and tracking down the adviser to try and press for breach of restrictive covenant? Good one.

Who is it that you think would be putting the hours and hours in to follow up on a restrictive covenant? There's one barely competent person in an HR department somewhere who has zero interest in the business matters of their employer.

Maybe I'll be proven wrong, but I doubt it.

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Tracey

Nov 28, 2012 at 12:20

No doubt this will go as well as his last press comment about recruiting hundreds of ex-Honsiter IFAs who "knew him well". Less than 10 joined !

These bank guys could well do with asking PS the following questions

- what is their current PS resignation / recruitment rate ? And how many have resigned in the last 4 weeks alone ?

- what is their exact number of registered IFAs ? (A lot less than the 910 on the PS system and down nearly 50% in 3 years wich is a good indication of satisfaction levels at PS)

- how many PS guys that left have ended up in a legal dispute with PS over their contract terms ?

Be warned, there are no leads or client banks (that an ex-bank adviser would recognise) and its easy in - very tough out.

Why do you think so many experienced IFAs are going elsewhere such as Sense, Truly, TP ?

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Interested Observer

Nov 28, 2012 at 12:27

Nice to see the spirit of community is alive and well amongst advisers! Surely Pos Sol deserve some credit for helping these guys get working again.

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Martinifa

Nov 28, 2012 at 12:30

Tracey do you not think that PS might be offering them client banks as the PS contract stated the clients are PS not the advisers.

If an adviser leaves and the trail is still being paid to PS, they can argue they have a legal obligation to appoint a new adviser to service that client under RDR.

They also have advisers on relax (retired) who's clients need to be serviced.

Interesting times, wait until next year and the real fun begins.

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Harry Peacock

Nov 28, 2012 at 13:05

Too may people see this message board as a PS punchbag and know little about the bigger picture. As soon as anything PS related comes up on the board, you (Tracey, Sceptic, Gerry Cooper, Andrew Goodwin) and the likes of you head for your key boards to discredit them.

PS are profit making. They have £16 million cash in the bank and assetts of £20 million. How are your networks doing in comparison?

I joined PS from Lloyds 3 years ago with my partner and it was the best move we ever made. Sure, retention rates are high and compliance can be frustrating. No different from any of the others.Good advisers are also leaving other networks and heading in PS's direction.

These new bank advisers who are coming on board can look forward to a world where targets do not exist and one where they will be seen as true advisers working with a highly professional National with the support of everybody involved at PS.

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chris connelly

Nov 28, 2012 at 13:29

It seems unlikely that the banks would pursue all the people that leave and continue relationships with the clients that they have been working with. Due to the number of people on the market it would surely be too big a risk, especially after the courts siding with advisors in the previous client ownership case with Towry, to take the thousands of advisors to court.

Also one of the key things is that it will come down to client choice, as with TCF now so prevalent in the market it will be the clients choice who provides them with advice.

If anyone would like to look at employed alternatives to the network model, you can contact me via chris.connelly@edenscott.com

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Interested Observer

Nov 28, 2012 at 13:30

I couldn't agree with you more Harry.

There's a thinly veiled agenda with most of the regular commentators on the PS blogs.

It's a shame as there used to be interesting discussion on these sites, rather than the constant flood of unfounded and extravagant claims made by recruiters that seem to have nothing better to do with their time.

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Hickky

Nov 28, 2012 at 13:31

@ Ian Peacock

following your history of RBS, Halifax and Lloyds I bet PosSol is the first time you were allowed to advise properly, and got out from the relentless pressure of bankassurance.

My argument against PosSol is not of allowing you the freedom to advise, more about what they provide you for their cut. Make it your aim to become directly authorised, it's not that costly and because you get the full income, you can do your own compliance, research etc but not pay a huge fee to others who are sucking away your lifeblood. If there are two of you, you can share costs and give more of your time to your clients. Be brave, go direct!

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Tracey

Nov 28, 2012 at 13:33

@ MartinIFA

Normally when an adviser leaves PS and goes elsewhere so do nearly all their good clients as that is what they take whenn they leave. Only an unserviced handful tend to be left behind with PS.Any IFA would struggle to make anything tangible with these "client banks"

When a retiring PS IFA takes Relax they are entitled to the ongoing trail so if the client is appointed to a new PS IFA they wouldthen have to "mov"e the investments to generate new trail - not something I am sure PS can legally do in the Relax contract otherwise it would be worthless.

Under the Buyout agreement, all trail remains with PSHO and any clients passed out do not come with trail , so again a new PS adviser would have to "move" his funds to generate new trail - which of course PSHO have paid 4 times for so I dout they would allow this.

So, no, I cannot see where a "client bank" would come from, I can see where a list of names could come from but we all have a phone book as well.

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Tracey

Nov 28, 2012 at 13:51

@ Harry and IO

PS are in an improving financial position, agreed, have near £20m cash and no debt but this is built on increased retention rates as you mention, minimum fee of £8,750 pa, reduced recruitment fees and punitive exit costs on the rush of leavers which is short term. Not sure it will look as rosey in 2013 when reduced IFA income and falling numbers bite PS.

Harry, recruitment is virtually non existent at PS, see the left hand bar on your home page. PS numbers show 910 IFAs which includes many leavers from earlier in the year and I understand active IFAs stand at south of 850 and have fallen again in the last 4 weeks with some notable resignations including ex-recruiters.

The ex-Honsiter guys who knew "Call me Pete" and his Honsiter team at PS wouldn't join them again - I wonder why ?

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*Sharon*

Nov 28, 2012 at 13:53

Tracey, I'm rather worried about you.

You seem to have some anger issues. Have you thought of talking to someone, to see if they can help you?

It's not healthy being so wound up all the time.

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A sensible IFA!

Nov 28, 2012 at 14:07

I'd hate to be the one who has to listen to her all the time!

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Martinifa

Nov 28, 2012 at 14:07

Tracey, do you think PS has told them this?

We left two years ago and have moved everything on TOA. We were not allowed to Novate, which I find very strange.

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Tracey

Nov 28, 2012 at 14:10

@ Sharon

Oh I am very chilled as are my posts, you must be a delicate flower

I just like to keep the PS PR machine and tub thumpers honest ;-)

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Rechto Stans

Nov 28, 2012 at 14:14

Tracey - maybe some yoga breathing tecniques could help you

whisper PS - on the in breath

I'm over you - on the out breath

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Tracey

Nov 28, 2012 at 14:18

@ MartinIFA

I think PS , from the David Harrison days, never had a real plan what to do with the orphan clients especially those they had paid 4 times trail for.They had to retain this income into year 5 without service just to break even, something they cannot do post RDR - so the numbers won't stack up unless they raid their cash reserves.

I am sure all of us have heard recruitment spins on "client banks" but really, how many of us really believe this now ?

These guys will mostly have to start with scratch with little marketing and no leads but hopefully this thread has given them the questions they need to ask PS before they join

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*Sharon*

Nov 28, 2012 at 14:18

Tracey, I've just had a thought, with your amazing insight and excellent knowledge surely there's a network or service provider you could recommend?

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Endangered Species

Nov 28, 2012 at 14:18

I genuinely fall asleep when I read her bullet pointed posts:

- BLA

- BLA

- BLA

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Tracey

Nov 28, 2012 at 14:19

Sharon, personally I would suggest they go to local IFA businesses to learn with established IFAs and develop their own local connections.

If they want to go it alone with a network I would suggest the smaller networks with fewer legacy issues

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Gerry Cooper

Nov 28, 2012 at 14:31

@ Harry Peacock -

Harry, I'm not anti PosSol - I know nothing about them, and I've never had any connection with them.

I am though, anti Network, because I do not believe that they add value to an IFA business in return for the money you pay them.

I can understand why you are happy to have escaped Lloyds, and I'm sure that the network model seems immeasurably better, which it is, BUT -

As Hikky says - Be brave, go direct, save money, you won't regret it! I was a network member in the 90's, since when the costs have risen and the benefits declined even further.

If you need support, which most of us do, to some extent,, there are many good support businesses around, and I don't mean the 'Direct' arms of the major networks, whhich to my mind, don't offer value for money.

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Michael Brown

Nov 28, 2012 at 14:41

Hikky

Yes there could be a problem. However, i would have a good wager to say that the trail is little or nothing on most cases!

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*Sharon*

Nov 28, 2012 at 14:47

Tracey, I think your first suggestion is very sweet, if a little Enid Blyton. In the harsh, cold light of the RDR I'm just not sure those opportunities really exist for those advisers let down by the banks.

Smaller networks with fewer legacy issues. Interesting.

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Stephen Ng

Nov 28, 2012 at 15:06

Let's not forget that those leaving Lloyds TSB and others, will have done so with redundancy payments. Ask the ex Barclays chaps what happened to them when they were found contacting old bank clients.... they were all taken to Law by their former emplloyer and had to repay their severance.

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Headcase

Nov 28, 2012 at 17:07

Citywire need to ask why report on PS recuiting 40 ex sales bank staff a news story?. What about writing about other networks / companies recuiting them to and knocking them too. As an existing IFA for 8 years with PS - we are still here. £20 million in the bank. No debt. Monthly profits. 900 IFA's. Thats after our founder left to set up TP. Other staff set up True PLan ( or what ever the name is ). PS is a succesful company WHATEVER you say. Its going to be interesting post 1/1/13 to see which networks are going to be in business in 2 years time. Remember this. I'm a R.I with PS. PS take the liabaility. When I leave, and a compliant is upheld. I have to pay upto the excess. The DA route. When you leave the industry, you have to mentain records, dropoff liab' insurance etc FOR LIFE. Which would you choose ??

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Anitaki

Nov 28, 2012 at 17:10

"Talks", yes, but PosSol actually recruiting 28 new people would be a headline!

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philip spierling

Nov 28, 2012 at 17:15

time to go for tea, curry night tonight, should i have a biryani or a madras,,,any thoughts would be appreciated

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