Towry claims to have cleared asset transfer backlog

Countdown continued. Friday transfers waiting was over £3,300,000 ............... today Monday, over £3,300,000!!! This has been a crude measure of what I know has yet to be transferred into clients new accounts out of Towry.

The terms and conditions for Towry Investment Mangement Ltd, that ex-Edward Jones had their money transferred over into, states:

"Section 18.4 - We shall within 30 days from when you tell us in writing; transfer or pay to you all or part of the ISA investments held or proceeds arising from those investments"

The key words in this very important statement are "to you". It doesn't say "we will transfer out" or "we will begin the process" or "clients will have to be involved in the process" or "third parties are responsible for completing the processs". Fine if it did but it clearly does not and nor does it warn clients of any other situation that may prevent Towry from meeting this promise.

Towry have clearly broken their terms and conditions with many clients. Transfers have not been completed as Towry promised they would be. To make matters worse the promises were broken for many clients months ago.

FSA where are you? Why are you permitting a company to flout their terms and conditions of business? How can consumers have confidence in the system when what is clearly in writing to them is totally ignored by a major company? It is making a mockery of terms and conditions of business which are a fundamental necessity in our industry.

As an aside how can a chief executive be quoted as saying he was unaware of just how archaic the system is and how long it takes"? He has either been misquoted or showing a very worrying lack of knowledge for a chief executive in this area. Perhaps this might give a clue as to why Towry are in such a mess.

This is a complete load of rubbish. My firm has MILLIONS of transfers still outstanding.

Bull. I still have some clients waiting.

Well that's just great. Well done all of you.

They say you can't polish 'certain things' but Peter Foster and Andrew Fisher have managed to glaze it with varnish.

Why are all these anonymous entries on here still - Anon 1 and Anon 2 why no be public and say what your company is?

Tell the facts if we all know who these millions are for something could be done about it surely ?

Tell the names of your firms and then everyone will know...I think there must be a reason you are not telling?

KT

I would love to believe this but I think blaming any further delay on third parties is a real cop out. No one from Towry has called me to confirm my S+S ISA has been transferred. Likewise when they missed their own transfer deadline of 28th May. They really are exceptionally poor at communicating to clients. Ho hum the damage has been done, their reputation in my eyes is in tatters. Now where did I put that FOS form...............

This is an extraordinary claim but only reinforces what we already know - that once again merits genuine investigation and I hope City Wire follow up with a balanced response asking the clients what they have found with their money.

It is the clients with their money that will decide whether this is true - time will tell.

And by the way who is Karen Tythe ? Is that an anon ?

They simply must be kidding!

Still waiting for asset transfers for clients since March. when they do send money, they do not know tell the recipient what it is for!

Rubbish!

I'm still waiting for at least 15 client accounts to be transferred from end of Feb beginning of March

To all you Ex EJ advisers out there, who no nothing about administration of accounts apart from what you knew from Edward Jones,.....

Blah blah blah blah blah.

Change the record - your clients haven't been financially disadvantaged. (willing to accept of course, that there will be some exceptions) Their funds are still good - they must be, you sold them originally. "Buy and hold" remember; "time IN the market, not timing the market" - unless of course YOU need to sell them,....

Yep time in the market for sure and vast majority of my cases are in-specie transfers but whilst Towry sit on them who's getting the trail £££???

So Towry have transferred the assets, so that's alright then. The fact that they haven't notified the custodians or the clients means there are now millions of pounds of assets still waiting to be claimed. As well as this there is the small matter of the £20 per line that is being charged to clients even those that have been waiting since Feb/Mar/Apr which was before the May switch over to Towry systems. Is this TCF if you charge some but not others and if the client complains you refund the charge?

My transfers have been with Towry since the beginning of Feb ane are all ISA's. No sign of them.......this has nothing to do with platform problems but everything to do with Towry. They are absolutely incorrigble in ther misrepresentation of the truth. They have been holding my ISA for 6 months without any real attempt to resolve the issue. What now FSA?

The FSA will do nothing. Towry have been speaking to them throughout the process and the FSA are well aware of the situation. If as a client, you have been financially disadvantaged, you have a right to complain to the FOS. If however, you are an ex EJ FA waiting for your trail commission or need to to "re-invest" the portfolio funds, then stop going on about it because nothing is gonna happen.

Oh, and by the way, in future, all individual mutual fund purchases made by Towry on behalf of the clients will only carry an initlal fee of 1.5% non of which will be rebated back to Towry.

Towry are implementing a full custody and dealing service which means all ex EJ clients will be able to buy and sell corporate bonds and shares on an execution only basis (at a much cheaper rate than Jones offered) and have access to the whole UT market without having to stockpile clients into their IIM service.

I for one am glad my adviser chose to stay with Towry

Let's ask.... Funds Network, St James Place, Cofunds, Raymond James, Selftrade, Charles Stanley, Barclays Wealth, Lloyds TSB Private Banking & Pershings what they think!!!! Towry have sent blanket instructions to all outstanding providers

Anon 6 - I was going to suggest exactly the same. According to Fisher & Co the platforms can now tell us that they have received ALL of these funds. Come on platforms, let's be hearing from you.....................................

Oh, and this still does not fully address some of the points made by clients on the 'treated shabbily' website does it?

Chaps, the sooner that you and any 'stranded' clients realise that TL are the Mandleson & Campbell of advisers the less stress you will have. Time wont fly any faster mind but at least you will know that a pinch of salt should be taken with every utterance.

I'll tell you what, every time Towry makes a pronouncement that 'things are now going to be better', we get one hell of a rush of clients signing up to the petition and saying otherwise. Keep 'em coming, Mr Fisher.

http://www.treatingcustomersshabbily.co.uk

John,

How many people are signed up to your petition?

KT

Karen Tythe - Do you work for Towry?

Stop dodging the question and stop inflicting your "my mates, brothers sisters stepbrothers son tenuous" "information" on us

Karen, last time I checked the www.treatingcustomersshabbily.co.uk

page and the 'what clients are saying' link there seemed to be lots of them stretching across quite a few pages.

I think you will find they are ex clients John

Who is Karen Tythe ?

Is this EMC in drag !

Or is it Fisher's mother ?

Towry claims to have cleared asset transfer backlog... Oh No they haven't!

So no answers again... How many people are actually on this petition...surely if the numbers are huge then it will be good to release the information?

Interesting again that as soon as someone asks the questions the attack Towry crowd get abusive...

KT

Karen, I have no axe to grind with EJ or Towry but I just want my and my wife's money £80k outstanding from November. The first £80k in corporate bonds came over in March, the cash in June after much pressure and the mutual funds still waiting.

I reserve my right to anonimity and await the response from the Financial Ombudsman where proceedings were started in March

I work for one of the large platforms who have been inundated with Ex-EJ/Towry law transfer requests.

Whilst TL's turnaround has been improving (it could hardly get any worse!) the posted article is a flat out lie.

I can tell you for a fact that we have over 1300 pending transfers from Towry, some of which date as far back as April.

The following line makes no sense whatsoever:

"Towry chief executive Andrew Fisher said that the IFA national had successfully transferred assets away from its systems, but that it would take longer for the assets to reach their new custodians."

Mr Fisher clearly doesn't understand how the transfer process works, and just sending a Stock Transfer Form to the appropriate Fund Manager does not constitute a "successful transfer", this is only the beginning of the transfer process.

As for the point about Platform to Platform transfers, well this is just moot! How exactly is a client going to transfer their Ex-EJ account to anything other than another platform?

This article is nothing more than a desperate attempt by TL to say "Look we did what we promised" and in fact is nothing more than a pack of lies. All it has done is angered IFAs even further and angered the companies to which all these clients are transferring to, as our Adviser Support Teams take many wasted calls from IFAs relieved in believing their Towry Law ordeal was finally over; only to be told: "We're sorry, the article is not true. Unfortunately your clients' assets are still in the process of being transferred."

When are the FSA going to step in and do something about this unacceptable situation?

I don't for one minute believe this 'Platform Administrator' is that... If you which platform?

Well Clive I do and if someone does some proper journalism and actually bothers to check the facts you will find that is closer to the truth than the economical spin put out in this article. But you continue to live in denial.

Towry have conducted a dump and run of stock. Nominee to Nominee transfer is fine if the receiving party are provided with the client details of who owns what. Sadly Towry seem to have forgotten to make available details of the clients who own the stock to other providers. As a result Towry have caused numerous stock breaks for other platforms/providers.

Towry start answering your phones or emails or you will be receiving this stock back.

Why would a platform administrator need to be annonymous. Towry have spoken to all platforms, they are all aware of what is going on and are stretched to take on the transfers but recognise it is their responsibility. I would suggest that the platform is not a platform at all but simply an ex-adviser who also happens to be a liar

I confess I am really enjoying looking into all this now...

I really cannot understand any longer why so many people on this discussion are anonymous - there is only one reason for this - subterfuge...(is that how you spell it!?)

I spoke to a journalist yesterday - not at Citywire but someone I work with and she said it is pretty well known now that this is all just bad eggs who don't like Towry's stance on some industry issues - the RDR apparently in particular - who are revelling in trying to throw mud at Towry.

Her comment seems quite sane to me - loads of Ex EJ advisers - getting hungry for their commissions have been plying misinformation to get them to move to new companies and that there is a suspicion that Mr Simpson is not all he is pretending to be...she didn't explain what that was but I was intrigued! Apparently there is a little investigation underway.

Karen, taking the word of a journalist as gospel. I would suggest the journalist is not trained in the minutae of financial transfers but in how to spin a good story!

I would go on to suggest that people who post on this site are not people who don't like Towry's stance rather they are people who don't like how they/their clients have been treated in this whole fiasco.

Most advisers I know are already fee based, but let's be honest, a management fee and trail commission are the same things dressed up differently. That said, the Towry management fee is typically more than standard trail commission. So, who would you conclude to be commission/'management fee' hungry?

Businesses need to be viable and have to charge for their service, if IFAs have not received a penny in income from client assets for nigh on 6 months due to this mess, then I would think a little deeper than the pure vitriol. These IFAs are people, they have families to feed, bills to pay and businesses to run. The clients are people who have worked hard to save money and then invest it, they feel completely disenfranchised, we are not just talking about 'assets' here. The sooner this mess can get sorted out the better, for all parties involved.

i thought all the advisers from EJ with existing clients were offered salaried jobs by TL but they opted to take the risks and rewards from being entrepreneurial after a strong track record of losing £260m over the last ten years. And taking trail commission for keeping clients in the same portfolio is just upfront conmmission paid over time. Come on you can do better than that surely Towry were paid by BP to distract the world media away from the oil spill. A cunning plan which has now been exposed

Karen Tythe and Anon 10 - its about clients and their money - that what comes first and here Towry have fallen well below what is acceptable.

More than10,000 clients have already made their decision on the Towry proposition- and with this reputation I think from what I hear many more will be following. Edward Jones were a total failure but equally Towry are no better. The shallowness of their proposition has been seen thro and is being exposed and it does not look pretty.

MPs, FSA and Ombudsman will investigate - I will watch with interest as the truth comes out !

Dear EX EJ Client

(still cannot fathom why you have that name and not your real name - could you be an advisers by chance?)

...anyway I hear what you say about falling below acceptable levels - but even Towry have admitted that - but let's be honest here the Towry proposition isn't for everyone is it?

Still a lot of people did stay with Towry - I mean I read only yesterday on another blog that EJ handed over 95,000 clients so losing 10,000 (if that is even an accurate number - you wouldn't know that unless you worked there??) is about right when they were probably (ike my friends) being told by their old EJ adviser (who obviously had an axe to grind) to get out...

I think this is a vendetta pure and simple...

KT

Luke

How do you get that management fees at Towry are more than trail - what rubbish...show me your calculation...I am a maths teacher and I think you need to rethink your working out!

I keep saying this - and I will again...Towry messed up, they seem to have admitted it I think a lot of people are merely hoping beyond hope there is some kind of hiddne meaning to this... I for one don't think there is...but hey I notice when I ask tough questions here they get over looked and avoided. I hate being taken for a mug and I can see through this little game...

KT

Karen, hopefully the mysterious Mr. Simpson will be unveiled. I think you are spot on, the vast majority of the posts here and 'so-called' signees to the petition are ex-advisors. Plain old sour grapes.

Sadly because EJ would hire anyone however incompetent, too many people got ideas above their educational station and thought they were stockbrokers. Not all EJ advisors were useless, there were some real gems and they stayed with Towry. But most of them couldn't handle a piggy bank with a hammer unless 'computer says soooo.'

I too am slightly amused at the vitriol thrown at anyone who posts even remotely balanced comments. I also find it extremely funny that for some reason one or two anonymous posters are convinced that Ellie Mae Clampett is male. Since I know for an absolute fact that Ellie Mae has given birth more than once perhaps I should be selling that story to the tabloids? And then invest my money with Towry.

The regulator needs to step in and order Towry to repay all the the trail fees Towry have profited from during this debacle at the very least back to the clients they have disadvantaged during delay that in many cases stretch back to February !

This as a minimum would be justice in practice and fair.

They should not be allowed to benefit from at best incompetence, at worst manipulation and being extraordinarily economical with the actualite !

In this day and age - unbelieveable. Come on the press investigate this shower if the regulator continues to fail to protect the consumer from this sharp practice.

Come on now, don't you think the press would have had even their most junior interns all over this if not more senior people if there really was a scandal? Towry have followed the rules. Ex-EJ people who chose to jump ship..... and broke the rules of their contracts ... the courts will tell don't you think?

And then perhaps their poor clients will finally realise that maybe having people over to barbecues and birthday parties might be nice but is not the best way to get financial advice. I like my gynecologist, but he is not a personal friend.

The regulator needs to step in and order Towry to repay all the the trail fees Towry have profited from during this debacle at the very least back to the clients they have disadvantaged during delay that in many cases stretch back to February !

This as a minimum would be justice in practice and fair.

They should not be allowed to benefit from at best incompetence, at worst manipulation and being extraordinarily economical with the actualite !

In this day and age - unbelieveable. Come on the press investigate this shower if the regulator continues to fail to protect the consumer from this sharp practice.

Karen.

Up to £100k invested = 2.175% annual fees (1% includes Vat) plus approx 0.75% fund AMCs (depending on the mix, ie ETFs are cheaper) plus other fund costs of approx 0.15%. Total annual charge for investment of £100k = approx 3.075%. This excludes the impact of initial charges on new investments. It includes one review of investments only, other reviews are charged at a fee. Hope this helps.

Thank you Anon 11 for your detailing of costs. I would add to your post the costs of other investments; some of the more expensive unit trusts have a TER of 2.75% that is about as high as it goes and is rare, most have a TER of 1.7%. Personally I would avoid the higher TER due to the costs, the client's money should be working for them.

I would also point out that a (true) IFA could advise investing in a multitude of multi-asset investment vehicles at half the cost of Towry. This would provide the client with reduced risk through diversification.

I studied with interest the Citywire charts which show two of Towry's funds under-performing their benchmark (before management fees!).

Luke.

Worth mentioning the TERs you quote also include the 0.5% trail fee.

Thanks for the calculation Anon 11 - and how much would it cost with a commission taking adviser?

Barty

Anon 3 - I have not thought as an EX EJ Client taking Towry to court over this transfer debacle they have been responsible for. But it is a good idea thanks. I may join the group action being put together on the Shabby website that is being discussed about your great customer service.

It is about Treating Customers Fairly and putting them first - I can send you details if you havent got round to it. A lot to learn here.

Also the analogy of the gynaechologist is as weak as the expensive, underperforming intellectually shallow Towry proposition. Also with your poor attitude towards clients I know what your gyno sees when he looks at you!

The clients will tell and are doing so and the momentum is growing.

Ex EJ 'Client' Comment - IF you are a client of any kind, which I doubt, much more likely an out of work ex-advisor who should have stuck to being a bin man. Just because EJ gave you a business card it did not make you a stockbroker. Get over it and get another job.

You can do anything you like about 'my' customer service since I do not have any customers. But it sure would be fun to see you try to sue me. Which country would you sue in. Where you live? Where I live? Where I go on holiday?

Anon 3 - I rest my case - IQ. It is all about intellect and honesty.

Clients, of which I am one, come first.

I also prefer choice as a client - transparent costs - and not being shoe-horned or churned into one of 5 standard portfolios. Wuh! Best way for financial advice. Yeah ! And great service thrown in.

My IQ is fine. As is my honesty. Unlike yours. So go on, try answering the question. Which country are you going to sue me in? And for what? Recognizing you as a liar who should have stuck to being a bin man and not been fooled into thinking you were a stockbroker simply because some sleazy American company gave you a nice business card with your name on it?

Interesting, read this from another forum, you see the truth will out.

http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=34246645

The comment begins as follows: I was one of the ex EJ advisers who transferred across in to Towry, now dont get me wrong there are a lot of improvements that need to be made to the systems in place at Towry, however a majority are not directly the fault of Towry. '

It is long and very detailed and VERY telling. Tthreats of violence? Pretty much confirms what I have been saying from day one. The majority of EJ advisors were in the wrong job in the first place. Not all, some are very good, but the majority? By the look of it, undereducated thugs.

Anon 3.

I read this a while ago. Unfortuanately the adviser gives him/herself away when he starts talking fees. He assumes EJ switched almost all the portfolio every year. Absolute rubbish. He also states the only AMC applied to the Towry funds as being 0.75% - 2.0% "and no other charges". Again absolutely incorrect. There are additional underlying fund charges of up to 0.75% and additional expenses of approximately 0.15%. He also omitted the Vat applicable to anything over 1% of the service charge and forgot the fact that the payments are scaled. There is 2.175% on the first £100k invested, then so much up to £250k etc. Therefore the £1m plus investors can still end up paying far more than 0.75%. Also, don't forget the initial charges and the ongoing fees for reviews other than your annual investment review.

As for threats of violence. It is the first time I have heard of any instances and to suggest the majority were thugs is somewhat over the top.

All of you - stop the venomous, insulting and vicious comments! It's ludicrous and no good for the industry. Can't you make your point without nastiness????

Anonymous 7 I have tried repeatedly to make comments with no hint of nastiness over the past several months. I first appeared here simply because I did a search on Edward Jones, a company that have absolutely no respect for and feel that their appalling hiring practices have caused enormous amounts of grief to clients and employees alike.

But because I was not Towry bashing I have been called just about everything under the sun including the really offensive and sexist comment by the self proclaimed Ex Client (who is in fact an unemployed and very bitter ex-advisor)above - quoting his delightful words ' I know what your gyno sees when he looks at you!'. Pretty much sums up my point don't you think?

I agree, he is not doing the industry any favors at all. The only plus I can see is that the purchase of EJ by Towry has succeeded in removing many self-proclaimed 'stock-brokers' from the industry which will ultimately benefit the clients and the industry as a whole.

Good for you Anon 7. You are spot on

By the way, to EX EJ Client Comment. When you post a comment, or even visit, any website you leave a digital footprint that anyone with even a rudimentary level of programming knowledge can read. If you post as an 'advisor' on one site and claim to be an 'ex client' on another, we can see you. Just as we can see when you register multiple 'identities' on, say........ oh dunno, a fake petition site?

The government knows this too, having a petition with hundreds of names all apparently using the same computer, browser and internet connection is not going to have much impact. Just sayin'.

Anon 3 - this seems to have got to you - I think www.treatingcustomersshabbily.co.uk - is from what I can see a genuine site - have a read - there appears there is a case to answer - investigations etc I think it is doing well and being watched by a lot in the media bringing matters that need addressing to attention.

After all clients come first.

1000 complaints and growing Towry speaks for itself - of course they are all wrong - these innocents who will need compensation.

Time will tell eh! I agree with you the truth will come out. When it does be man enough to eat your bias and think of the client. That is called TCF. You should try it - it works rather than the spin and abrogation of responsibility reflected in this article.

I will be happy when all my transfer is accounted for with a closing statement - this should have been automatic for a company that follows TCF.

sigh..... and yet again... you say 'be man enough...' even when you posted the really offensive 'gyno' comment. This just proves to me that you are

a) the person with multiple IP personalities posting on that site - ask your IT friends about IP look ups and how you have been found out. A petition with numerous signees coming from the same computer/browser/internet connection can be clearly seen.

b) sexist

c) not a client of any kind but in fact an unemployed ex-'advisor' who was hired to be in the wrong job in the first place because you are obviously completely underqualified.

As for TCF as I have no customers/clients why should I worry either way? You on the other hand................... As I said, every keystroke can be monitored. Enjoy, baby, enjoy.

And no, I am not a man so I guess I will be woman enough to laugh when you lose the court case.

Anon 3 - confirmed. I rest my case.

Delighted. I am glad to see your capitulation. Now, would you like to explain who you really are to the interested few on this forum? I know who you are. So do the people at Citywire. :-)

Good effort anon 7, unfortunately still a bit to go. Let's just keep to plain facts boys and girls.

Plain fact - if you set up a complaining website and use a cheap hosting company and badly written HTML, a lot can be read when viewing the source code. :-)

Oh and another tip. Don't use obvious passwords. God this is such fun.

Andrew Fisher's Conscience Speaking !!!

TL are removing client investments from their records when the investments themselves still sit in their nominee account and have not yet been transferred.

In some instances I am not even sure they have sent the stock transfer forms yet for re-registration on Unit Trusts.

Come on Fisher where is your sense of right and wrong ??? I think you lost that some time ago.