Towry hit by 729 complaints over asset transfer delays

Mr Foster, did you know you can make 78.2% of people believe anything with statistics?

So Mr Foster is admitting that some clients have been delayed since before October 2009. This means that Towry has delayed some clients by over 9 months!

For Mr Foster to say that ONLY 2% of those clients wanting to tranfer had complained is disgraceful. One complaint is one too many. And for a major company, that publicly declares they are an example for the industry to follow, having any clients complaining to the Ombudsman, is a massive contradiction.

Great to hear however that Mr Fisher is still saying it will all be cleared by the end of July.

Smoke and mirrors - Peter Foster is stating that some transfers date back to pre-takeover as if that makes it OK, YOU TOOK OVER EJ, any mess is your mess!.

When Towry start taking ownership, rather than "its not my fault" mentality, maybe then we'll start getting some movement

Er, does that mean that Edward Jones had 243,000 clients when it was taken over? That is approaching twice as many as Brewin Dolphin, which is, by far, the industry leader! Brewin had eight times the turnover of Edward Jones.

Or are the numbers above unrelated to each other?

729 complaints is a lot in any context. Is the FSA taking any interest?

Am I missing something here. 15% of 50,000 = 7,500. 729 out of 7,500 = 9.72%. Therefore 9.72% of transfers have so far resulted in official complaints. That is unbelieveably high and suggets to me the vast majority of transfers have had problems. Almost 1 in 10 transfering clients going to the trouble of registering a complaint is cause for great alarm!!

This is all so bad. I bet they regret revamping their Investment Ops and giving it to SEI. To sum up: They're stranded in sh*t creek, they lost their paddle miles ago and are just heading straight for the rapids.

Only 729 complaints? Why then do current Towry Law holding letters in response to complaints bear references starting COM (presumably for 'Complaint'), followed by numbers in the 7000s? Perhaps a decimal point has been inadvertently misplaced...

from ex BOA

I'm sad to say that all of us Towry knockers are right - poor clients! At least this is being reported now, and yes EMC I will keep banging on about it until resolution.

This morning, I received an email from the transfer department of the company I joined post Jones.

It lists at least 15 clients with transfer issues from Towry dating back to February / March.

They told me they have reached a cul-de-sac with chasing Towry for the transfers and suggest I ask all of them to personally complain to both Towry and the FSA.

I wonder how many more complaints they will receive in the next month.

Pound to a penny TL know exactly how many pending 'complaints' they have and how many are actually in their system that will / may then be taken by the client to the FSO once the client has lost patience with TL excuses and promises.

Ergo: Pound to a penny this is pure spin and damage limitation. The story is out there and gaining attention so better to fess up to 729 than the number that it will be sooner or later.

Such utter bu**s*** the entire process and pity the clients that did not want to stay with the new bunch being stuck in limbo for the time frames suggested.

Who is to say that the 75% of those who havnt requested a transfer are not just biding their time until TL get more efficient and clear the backlog?

And 15% of any client bank going for a walk is a big number in any context for any firm. Clearly the 'message' didnt get across and one should be asking why not. Perhaps all that glitters is not gold, although those with any experience know all that glitters is not gold anyway.

Have not heard much from that Midgleton chap lately either - where hides he now?

Just read this from the Towry/Ascentric piece a few days back:

"Andrew Fisher,Towry chief executive, said Towry would deliver on its pledge to sort out the transfer backlog.

‘It will be completed by the end of the month. All the responsibility Towry has will have been executed. It will then take some of the platforms more time to deal with that, but there’s nothing we can do about that,’ he said.

Fisher added that there had been 9,000 requests to transfer assets onto platforms in the last six months."

------------------- ---------------------- ---------------------------- -------------------

So one should therefore expect to see no more about transfers stuck at TL as it will all be done by their 10 man hit squad in less than the next 13 days.

9,000 request to transfer is only in the last 6 months - back until Jan then and supposedly not including any previously if there were any.

729 complaints out of 9,000 transfer requests is 8.1%

My money says that all 3 of these figures are going to rise before Xmas.

And what a surprise Towry look to blame someone else - he should be made responsible to repay all the trail for the collectives they have hung onto and extra compensation for the stress this incompetence has shown to clients.

I agree this is the start of the complaints not the end.

Treating customers shabbily.

It might 'only' be 15% of Jones clients transferring, but I wonder if Towry will admit the percentage of assets taking a walk?

In response to Anon 4, Towry have stated (in an e mail) to a client this week that the client is not entitled to the trail!

Im just an uninformed customer - what happened to customer service? Lets ignor them for months, scare them, issue empty promises to call back and provide ridiculous delays. 2% phah, thats only the people who had their complaint recognised, I've tried to make a complaint - got no response. Now the phone is constantly engaged ....

The FSA inform me that they don't investigate complaints Aaaaaahhhh

It's my money and I require it to move NOW please

Anon 10 - who is entitled to the trail fee ? Surely not Towry ? As an offer of goodwill Towry should offer to refund this trail to the people they have disadvantaged.

If Towry choose to accept and retain the trail when they have not provided any advice or service, in fact just the opposite, then this is exactly where the regulators should look into.

Towry should not be allowed by the regulator to profit from this deliberate obstructive behaviour mixed with incompetence. TCF - along way short ?

Merits investigation - shabby.

To Lynne

I suggest you ask for a particular name if you ever get through to Towry - the name of your FA or BOA if they were retained by Towry. I am an ex BOA and get to talk to my old colleagues that way. Always get a name and number from whoever you end up speaking to as they often have separate numbers. The ex EJ people will do everything they can to help but themselves are running up against brick walls and a lot are suffering real stress because of this.

Make a lot of noise, and go on doing so. This treatment of clients is appalling.!

www.treatingcustomersshabbily.co.uk is worth a look at.

This blog has brought about an excellent use of statistics - not wishing to be left out, if the average EJ portfolio balance was £30,000 and the 15% of Jones assets amount to 7500, this means that approximately £225 MILLION pounds worth of assets are due to be or have been transferred out of Towry - representing with say a 0.5% trail an income of approximately £1.125 Million.

729 complaints again using the average balance means that £21.87 MILLION pounds worth of client money is being held against the clients wishes - so much so that they have had to bring a formal complaint to get this resolved. The FSA should be paying close attention here as they could have a Northern Rock on their hands if tey don't act decisively.

Again using the average balance of £30k Mr Fishers 900 transfers in the last 6 months mean that £270 MILLION has been moved out of Towry in just 6 months, this is before ex EJ advisers have reached the freedom of post covenenant land where all monies become fair game - good luck spinning that!

Should read 9000 transfers above

Anonymous 11, average transfer value for my transfers is in excess of £85,000 per account. Most transfers appear to be of this higher value than the overall average, because these are the clients who tend to actively contact former brokers, to maintain a relationship.

1. The trail being received was increased just before the sale of Jones (without clients being advised). It's now more like 0.75%. Towry have never revealed to clients, this new increased revenue split.

2. Re the transfers the clients transferring tend to be larger than average. There were thousands of relatively inactive accounts, with next to nothing in them. I would guess an average transfer size much closer to £100,000.

and on that theme, I have transferred assets (mainly in-specie) from Towry over the last 8 mths, relatively small nos. but £1.06 M between just 14 clients = av of £76k...and none of mine complained, they graciously accepted the slow grind. My point I suppose is that if a small player like me has shifted £1M + under the complaints radar then the true outflow from Towry must be enormous, but I doubt we'll ever know the true figures.

not sure the maths adds up lets say it is £300m the trail is 50bp( the trail up lift is on only a few funds and mostly comes into effect in june 2010) but on half the assets as half are bonds and shares with no trail the delay is a maximum of 6 months on 30 percent of the assets this looks like Towry is making less than 100k afetr allowing for a normal transfer period I would suggest that they will pay a lot more in poor pr and should get on with the transfers and stop annoying the industry

Does anyone look beyond or underneath this current EJ transfer debacle and consider what this actually means to the underlying cash flow & general infrastructure of this business?

With such large outflows it surely has a detrminental affect upon monies TL have and given that there are plenty of non EJ clients what will this mean to them?

Someone above likened to a Northern Rock and whilst i would not suggest it would go that far i would expect that some degree of service must be cut or charged extra. Maybe job cuts leading to less staff to deal with those clients remaining meaning less service taking longer leads to more complaints leads to more outflows leads to charging more to maintain the same cash flow leads to....

I recall there is a saying about toads in saucepans or something.

Supposition maybe but the bookies would give odds. It will be interesting to see how this chapter ends.

I always new that the Investment Operations change that happened last year at Towry (moved it to SEI in London and cut most of the Towry jobs) would come back and bite them in the behind. Good to see that shoddy management and a blatent lack of planning pays off. We all new this would happen

I feel very sorry for all the clients who have not been able to transfer funds away from Towry within acceptable timescales. This level of service is totally unacceptable and I hope that suitable compensation is paid by Towry where they are at fault and losses have occurred. However, as an EX EJ employee the same is happening with transfers out of the EJGPP. According to Mercers, Towry are not releasing contract notes which means transfers out cannot progress. Has anyone else experienced similar problems? If so, I suggest you approach the PAS.

How many complaints have they really had?

Is the figure of 729 complaints the one that Towry has reported to the FSA? We are getting increasing evidence that clients are not heading their letter "Complaint" and so Towry are treating it as a 'query' or concern'. Neither of which, we understand from the FSA, have to be reported.

Many more complaints at:

http://www.treatingcustomersshabbily.co.uk

John I understand that all of your transfers have been completed,ie they are in the market awaiting your new custodian to register them, Towry can do no more ALL transfers for ALL ex clients will be in the market by the end of next week ,no clients have been out of the market at anytime and whilst annoying for clients 99 percent of all clients have simply taken an extended period to be in a position to have a new custodian. NO money has been lost by any clients . Towry have done all they could to allow an orderly transfer of a business where 50,000 clients were transferred as Edward Jones rapidly exited the UK market. 20 percent of the clients chose or were encouraged by their advider to transfer to new custodians. The new Towry business has managed to transform the old EJ business to being commercially viable and indeed profitable. Something that EJ failed to do in 11 years where it accumulated £260 million of losses. of the £1.5 Bn of assets that EJ advised on after all transfers Towry will be looking after over £1. 2 Bn. Towry continues to look after £ 3.6 Bn of discretionary assets in addition to the EJ business. The FSA are fully aware of the rescue that Towry undertook of the EJ business and the reasons for the backlog and the fact that the backlog is almost cleared. They are also aware that the vast majority of the clients who transferred have incurred substantial transfer costs as the ex EJ advisers have charged large up front commissions and have almost entirely left the portfolios in exactly yhe same portfoilios as previously. On average the towry discretionary portfolios have returned more that 1 percent to their clients in the first 6 months of the year with no portfolios having a negative return. On average the EJ model portfolios have lost clients between 7 and 15 percent for the same period with no portfolios producing positive returns. Why not just let it go and accept the profuse apologies that Towry have offered .

To Anon 14.

I really do not wish to comment on your figures, as I know for a fact, and from real experience, that many of the ramblings from Towry are less than reliable (being charitable).

Just focussing on the facts, why should Towry be allowed to get away with this mess? Towry themselves continually advocate that there are certain acceptable standards expected from a supplier of financial services. A simple question to you and Towry - Do you feel Towry have reached those standards?

Maybe a real apology, admission they have messed up and compensation would help, rather than excuses, spin and untruths.

There is no pleasing some people, quite hard to compensate people when they havent lost anything. The real concern is that a lot of these clients appear to have been frightened to death by their so called new advisers who know perfectly well how the transfer process works and the fact that an in -specie transfer means no change except the platform administrator. many of these advisers should apologise for the concern they have caused unnecessarily to the people they claim to want to look after. There is no spin Towry have apologised for the inconvenience to each client on an individual basis and many times over. In an ideal world the transfer would have not been backlogged in the USA to begin with and Towry should have picked up the delay earlier. The vitriol from what is already a fairly disgraced industry is sad but predictable, the constant winding up of vulnerable clients is unacceptable.

Obviously many of those involved have got the wrong end of the stick and are probably imagining what has been happening. Everything Towry have said is 100% accurate, they have told it absolutely as it is and the vast majority of clients have had transfers completed within the time frame Towry stipulate in their terms and of course, there is only a small minority of clients who have waited more than three months for their transfers. I, and my clinets, were just unlucky and certainly not representative. Obviously Towry have apologised to each client on an individual basis (not aware of that happening with me as a client or the clients I represent). The fault lies entirely with eveyone else. Towry are blameless in all of this.

Your comments demonstrate the line you are taking is very much in line with that of Towry and adds nothing to credibility.

OMG - The great Towry 'rescue' of poor EJ clients, who have not lost anything!

Unbelievable rubbish!

Anon 14 - many wonder why TL are despised by clients and the advisor community alike. It is the corporate arogance that has filtered down from Andrew Fisher to 90% of employees who actually believe what they are saying - hence your post. But i will tell you know, it is not your fault - one day when this whole sad episode has finished, and Palemon and Fishy have sailed off to the sunset, you will realise.

Think about it for a second - if you were an advisor trying to save a client costs, you would transfer in specie and then do any switching that was needed - so by TL being so innefficient, this switching has been delayed and in itself could cause a client financial loss - in the worse case scenario, the existing stock could have fallen and the stock that the client intended to buy has risen. This is why many more complaints will occur over the coming weeks and months.

John Simpson - you have no facts and are simply a trouble maker, you always put out statements of fact when in fact you haven't got any real facts at all - I think people are seeing through your little facade ! I think you love this attention and are reveling in the notoriety and in the process scaring poor people who have been conned into believing you.

You make seemingly accurate data with your biased little website - and I know from people who have posted to your site that you have used your privacy code on the site to take down anything you don't like to read...this is editing of the worst order...I heard from a friend today that their posting to your site never made it to the readable version...how many of these have you taken down without tell people?

Why have you never answered the question about your links to EJ? I here you are friends with EJ ex advisers...all of a sudden your sham becomes apparent.

Come on tell the assembled masses - you have an agenda here. I have it on good authority you are infact working with ex EJ advisers...

I for one am fed up with your games.

Karen.

I take it from your comments you are happy with the Towry performance of 729 complaints so far (by their own admission), the tip of the iceberg. They are not delivering good service, yet you appear to be supporting them. Good luck to John, who has highlighted what is happening. What he says is absolutely true and, in the real world everyone (including Towry) realise it. Sometimes the truth hurts

Karen, I would say that if John is factualy incorrect Towry would sue, as the website is still up and running then there must be some truth in what has been said, a lot of the quotes on the site are from publicity that Towry has released.

Towry Spin the information and facts to make them look good, likewise the website spins information to make them look bad - I would say that in my opinion a customer driven initiative is less likely to have shareholders, profitability, esteem, brand etc etc etc in mind but is simply individuals wanting access to their money when they ask for it (In the agreed timescales).

Your "friend" who has heard this that and the other should perhaps just concentrate on listening to the overriding theme of the website or the countless comments left after Towry related articles which is simply to just get the customer care bit right, the rest all follows.

It appears, and this is just my opinion here, that Towry are accustomed to taking over companies, stripping the clients out that they want to have as clients and leaving the rest to fester away (Every client aspires to be a Towry clent after all), with this acquisition maybe the clients that they took on board actually value service and don't aspire to be Towry clients.

The confusing thing for me is that the messages from Towry conflict, the problems are all someone elses (Towry took over Edward Jones at the end of October, how far back do these problems date?) the number of transfers is small and nothing for the shareholders to worry about (Yet they can't action the requests so how just how inefficient are they?), they only have 729 complaints (All about the same thing, that can't be good even for a company the size of the Lloyds group), nobody has lost any money (£6.50 per BP share in April, £4.20ish now!), I always believe if you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything, perhaps this is what Towry are relying on!

I never thought I would be driven to write something on a chat site. The transfer debacle is shocking and is reflecting very badly on Towry. However, there are a lot of people making statements fuelled by some EJ-Towry/Towry-EJ hatred.

The way I see it is Towry offer a good proposition to the clients who 'buy in' to their ideals. Likewise EJ was good at what they did for their clients - forget company profit and loss, speaking purely in the IFA role. (Both Towry and EJ made losses, EJ made losses as any company does when it has such commitment to growth, the losses were not unexpected - the turn in the economy, new CEO at EJ and major drive in cost cutting led to EJ UK sale)

Clients are leaving Towry because:

1 - the client proposition originally signed up for was very different:

Towry offer discretionary portfolio services, view their clients as - just that. See their clients once a year. Contact them when there is a business need ie when their boss says they need to hit their target into IIM.

EJ offered advisory service, ie relationship - sat down with clients and discussed their portfolios and decisions for investing with them. A totally different client. EJ advisers lived in the community they served. Clients became more than clients. No boss was informing where clients should invest.

2 - Company philosophy is very different. At EJ - client came first, then adviser then Firm. Towry - Towry comes first (read management/private equity) then adviser, then client. How can the client come first when private equity are involved?

EJ clients evidenced this with the closing of local offices, office centralisation, cancelling dividend reinvestment, statements every 6 mths and a distinct lack of contact from Towry.

Towry brought the wrong business. The adviser match wasn't there nor the client match. It is for these reasons that clients are transferring.

However, for Towry not to be ready for some increase in transfers is arrogant beyond belief. The response time of Towry to react to and resolve this situation demonstrates Jamaican beach-bum-like efficiency. The most pertinent issue the FSA and Towry need to understand is that this is retail clients' savings, this is their money -NOT Towry's to hold on to until such a time as they can sort their shabby act out. Regardless of what excuses Towry give the FSA, the FSA needs to be seen to be protecting clients' interests, Towry are failing to treat customers fairly. The FSA is failing to provide any protection. And Towry, you need to stop attending shareholder meetings and discussing the potential share price and start looking after clients (present and departing)

Towry would save some face if they sent a letter from Mr Fisher personally to clients to apologise (as I am positive would have come from Tim Kirley if such a thing had happened at EJ) but Mr Fisher is unable to accept fault, he has the people skills of a dead skunk and clearly his ability to empathise is on a par with Darth Vader.

Personally, I am VERY glad I am not at Towry. How one can be independent yet only recommend an in-house investment proposition is beyond me (and only receive bonus on investments going into that investment. Conversely, I am sure there are happy Towry advisers. I could not be happy in the knowledge that the more I invested in the in-house proposition the more the share price may be - who are we trying to benefit here? Also, I have never met company management that were so against everything I look for in management. However, horses for courses. Maybe some people are masochistic and enjoy that type of environment.

Good luck to Towry (but beware karma), good luck to ex-EJones folk.

And how cathartic was writing that!!??!

To Luke Skywalker

How pleasant to see somebody posting in a thoughtful manner.

Great job! (as Niemann would say)

Now I understand what ex EJ advisers meant by a balanced and thoughtful approach to investing, buying RBS equity and Lehmans bonds. nice one Luke! bit harsh on the skunk though

Sad fact is that Towry will no doubt come out of this with funds under management of £1B - if the FSA does nothing and says nothing - how can they seriously state they regulate the industry for the benefit of the Customers ?

All businesses have their problems - but it would appear Towry more than others - maybe a significant fine would wipe that smug smile off Andrew Fisher's face . . . . though since his pension's sorted he couldn't really give a **** about the customers.

Anonymous 14 - Your wit is devastating! RBS and Lehman were the only two investments recommended by EJ. EJ has a history dating back to 1922, it is a vastly successful organisation but above all its ethics were flawless. Towry should aspire to this!

In an earlier post (Jul 25th) you mention how disgraceful it is to be winding up vulnerable clients. Please put yourself in their shoes for a minute - Who or what do you honestly think is winding them up? Just maybe it is the issue that THEIR savings have not been transferred by the 'custodian' according to their wishes. Added to that, the transfers have taken nearly 6 months and show no signs of progressing. The clients feel disempowered. Towry feeds them lines - or as you say apologises - that go unsubstantiated which results in the client fearing that Towry is not in control of the situation (which they clearly are not). They lose more of the little trust they had in Towry. So, perhaps this is winding them up. The number of apologies you mention, Towry has never held their hands up, they remain blameless.

Once again it is arrogance and a loss of touch from human sentiment that means you are unable to deduce this. I can only assume, therefore, that you are a) a politician b) work for Towry or c) one of Mr Fishers pitbulls / management hounds d) trying to squash the rebel alliance and lead the Dark Side to victory.

Luke - I think that you should retract some of your comments posted on Jul 27, 2010 at 18:10 as I am concerned that you will soon be recieving a writ from the Dark Side and/or the family of one deceased skunk for defamation of character.

wait a minute Luke you originally had strong and somewhat un-natural feelings for your sister and then discovered that your father was the most evil person in the universe. As a humble ewok i am merely observing that the dark forces are not always what they appear to be the empire in this instance may well be those who are trying to re-create a world which has passed and the future may well belong to those who truly act as agents of the client which in case you are not following the plot would be Towry.... may the force be with you

to anon 14 - I believe that you should retract some of your comments as I am concerned that you will soon be recieving a writ from the second most evil person in the universe as he clearly thinks he should be top of the table. Luckily he can save the stamp and walk it downstairs...................

Silly me - he will get a clone to do it xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

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In response to 'Ex-Towry'

"I always new that the Investment Operations change that happened last year at Towry (moved it to SEI in London and cut most of the Towry jobs) would come back and bite them in the behind. Good to see that shoddy management and a blatent lack of planning pays off. We all new this would happen"

I always look forward to these Citywire scoops on Towry, safe in the knowledge that I'll find mild amusement in those perpetual comments by a minority of ex-staff with hefty sacks of Maris Pipers which still to this day weigh down heavily on their weary shoulders.

Speaking of which, I hear McDonalds are hiring for dynamic knew team members in your area...

OK, I agree with some of you, this is STUPID. I hope citywire reports at the end of the month with an update on transfers.

In all seriousness though, there is one thing that i would like to ask Andrew Fisher direct.....

Mother, mother

There's too many of you crying

Brother, brother, brother

There's far too many of you dying

You know we've got to find a way

To bring some lovin' here today - Ya

Father, father

We don't need to escalate

You see, war is not the answer

For only love can conquer hate

You know we've got to find a way

To bring some lovin' here today

Picket lines and picket signs

Don't punish me with brutality

Talk to me, so you can see

Oh, what's going on

What's going on

Ya, what's going on

Ah, what's going on

In the mean time

Right on, baby

Right on

Right on

Father, father, everybody thinks we're wrong

Oh, but who are they to judge us

Simply because our hair is long

Oh, you know we've got to find a way

To bring some understanding here today

Oh

Picket lines and picket signs

Don't punish me with brutality

Talk to me

So you can see

What's going on

Ya, what's going on

Tell me what's going on

I'll tell you what's going on - Uh

Right on baby

Right on baby

what is with the 'off the record' stuff. not anonymous anymore? call me cynical but i smell legalities somewhere. and why should one need to have a 'very good reason' to hide identity? surely one has a right to privacy and thus can choose simply to hide identity with or without reason? if you dont like liberty and right to privacy Citywire you can always remove accounts.

methinks this shall be the last post perhaps.

In response to Patrick Bateman

Firstly, why are you defending how utterly crap Towry are? Type 'Towry' into Google and then select news and they don't exactly come up with good headlines. Even a guy from Towry's London office, who I spoke to today at work (not McDonalds), told me today that things were 'a shambles'! I don't like them because they treated staff badly and gave us measley redundancies thats why. I'm sure you'd feel the same if it happened to you.

Secondly, out of all the names why Patrick Bateman, a fictional serial killer?

I'm not surprised that Towry is a shambles with some of the 'muppets' working for them that have transferred across from Edward Jones Ltd. Now clients are being held to ranson, sorry I meant ransom!

I hear all transfers have been completed from the Towry end.

To Anon 3 - and I heard that pigs can fly!

Where is the evidence, for the clients who have complained, that their complaints have been resolved?

Anyone caught up in this whole mess should only deal with concrete evidence that anything has been done.

Anonymous 2, where is 'your' evidence to the contrary?

To Anon 3 - I guess you don't read other Citywire articles and comments and the website that has been created by clients and advisers.

As of Friday clients that I know of had over £3,300,000 waiting to come into their accounts from Towry. Most of these clients have been waiting for over four months for the transfers. All of these clients were promised by Towry that their investments would be transferred out within 30 days. As of Friday they did not have these assets settled in their accounts. Therefore the transfers have not been completed by Towry. Towry may be able to say that they have initiated the transfers but this means nothing to a client who has suffered from Towry's broken promises in the past.

And that's just some evidence for starters. Now enlighten the interested parties with your evidence that the transfers are completed - it will make my day!

It has been explained to me that all the responsibility Towry had, has been executed. It will now take some of the platforms more time to deal with that, but there’s nothing Towry can do about that.

Towry only manage Towry issues. For instance they do not manage the wrap platform Ascentric .

Makes sense to me.

To Anon 3 - I think you need to read the Sunday Mail and see what Towry are themselves saying publicly rather than what has been explained to you.

Statements to the press from Towry like "there are few more things to resolve" and "we've sorted transfer problems" doesn't sound like "the transfers have all been completed" - or am I missing something????

The next issue will be the charges Towry are randomly applying to the transfers. The client has to actively ask if charges have been applied (no statements), complain, and then they will receive a refund of the charges plus a small amount of compensation (goodwill) as final acceptance of the complaint. What is going on?

I trust my advisor, that's what I was told. I don't believe everything I read in the newspapers. Interviewers can be very selective when it comes to quotes. I am happy with the way my money has been and is being managed.

I understand that Towry are charging clients according to the contractual arrangements they entered into. There are no contactual conditions with respect to transferral to new custodians. The backlog I understand is now clear from Towry's perspective. There is clearly an industry issue that makes in specie transfers a protracted process but in terms of inconvenience it is the equivalent of a client transferring their electricity supplier. The lights stay on throughout the process but the name at the top of the statement changes. The sad thing is that a number of clients appear to have transferred from a profitable utility company to one which is losing money and in danger of being closed or sold.

Anon 15. Quoting you "there are no contractual conditions with respect to transferral to new custodians". I absolutley agree, and that is m point. So why are towry applying a charge on a number of accounts, whilst not charging others in exactly the same situation (same no cost transfer platform and same transfer request date)?

To anon 15. Looking back on your posts, it appears you have the inside track. Back to the point of transfer fees. Can you please confirm Towry do not apply any tansfer fee, such as £20 per line for a standard transfer, unless the new custodian imposes a fee).

Just a humble client but it says on the contract that there is a transfer fee payable to edward jones for each line of stock transferred, not sure why there is any confusion unless those pesky rebel ex ej advisers can't read

Hang on I was an investor with EJ - err...they charged £20 per line for transfers too... what has changed here...umm NOTHING! I still think a lot of so called interested parties are actually on a vendetta now.

I notice when I posted a question to the 'Hero of the People' John Simpson about whether he is a friend of the advisers that left Edward Jones...and NO ANSWER. So I can conclude from that he is in league with them.

Is there not a question as to if there was any contract between the clients who had delays in their transfers (more than 30 days) and Towry. Surely if the terms of the contract are broken, there is not contract.

If this is true then how can any fees be charged? Perhaps there is some legal person out there who can offer some clarification.

That would be me. The terms of the contract do not state a maximum period of time for a transfer to take place. no contractual agreements have been broken, at least not by Towry not sure about the Ex-Ej advisers who have taken client data and appear to have breached their terms of employment in order to chase down ex clients to push them into new custody arrangements simply to take the trail commission.

Karen, you state you were an investor with EJ perhaps you have got your money when many other clients have not.

Edward Jones used to chew up and spit out their advisors if they were not achieving their targets (fact) they did this in the UK and still do it in the US, so lets not pretend that EJ was either great for clients or a great place to work for advisors. They have shown their true colours and Towry have continued in the same vein with a total disregard for all involved.

The whole thing stinks and their appear to be more losers than winners in this sad debacle

To Anonymous 15 - I thought that the terms of business for both Edward Jones and Towry say that ISA transfers will be completed within 30 days of the company knowing of the request to transfer. With some clients waiting more than five months this promise not been met and therefore the contracts are broken? Any views?

If you read the contract and you have probably copied it illegally, you will see that there is no contractual requirement for transfers to be carried out within 30 days, this is an industry desire under normal circumstances. It is different for a cash ISA but not in-specie transfers of shares and bonds

To Anonymous 15 - thank you for your kind comments - I was a client of Edward Jones and was given terms and conditions of business by them when my wife and I first opened accounts and was sent new terms and conditions by Towry around the end of March 2010.

I'm sure I read somewhere in both of them that stated 30 days limit for ISA transfers. I will have to dig them out to enlighten myself and I don't think I'll bother believing anything Anonymous 15 has to write from now on.

Anonymous 2, ' I don't think I'll bother believing anything Anonymous 15 has to write from now on.' but isn't that always the way when anyone dares to post any apposing view? My way of the highway in your world? Time will tell and I rather suspect, it already is.

To Karen. The only £20 charge EJ applied was for the re-reg of paper certification. Read the terms very carefully. If they do not refer to this then thay are not clear. There is no mention of "transfer" charges. Why are some clients being charged and others not?

Lets be frank here, Karen, Anon 15, Anon 3 you can be pro Towry all you like but how can you not admit that Towry cocked up and disadvantages/disadvanted clients - the simple questions are as follows:

Q1 Did the transfers complete within 30 days (Answer NO thus failure),

Q2 Is the backlog fully resolved by 31st July (Answer NO thus failure)

Q3 Are some clients charged and others not (Yes thus lack of transparency)

Well done though on your distraction techniques, Karen - a friend if a friends, sisters, uncles, mate told me that..........question back to Karen exactly what involvment do you have with Towry - are you on the payroll or is someone very close to you on the payroll? If so whom?

Anon 3 - I think you mistake people asking for further clarification as something else, if you make a statement and then someone comes back with apparent proof of the opposite, surely then you can undertand that your initial opinion is a moot point.

Anon 15 - the "Client" would you care to expand on the ilegally copied contract revelation? A client having the terms and conditions reardng tir investments is hardly likely to be Ilegal is it? How are you referring to the points in the contract if you too don't have a copy of these terms and conditions, are you confessing to illegality yourself? How long have you been working for Towry and how did you find the transition? How many assets have you manage to get into the ILM? The rebel advisers is clearly a Towry term, think about this logically though, what are they rebelling against? Do you really think that successful advisers would rebel against a former employer if their old clients were well looked after? Think they are rebelling against a company which in the clients own terms "Treats Customers Shabbily"

Oh and just another point, if you ring up Towry and ask them to transfer your Edward Jones holdings into the ILM, how much of a delay do you think that you will experience? Answers on a postcard!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Please note, I retract all previous posts as I am 100% confident that Towry are true to their word that all transfer backlog has been dealt with (it would be nice to understand how they classify a 'back-log'). They have proven to honour their word in the past so I humbly accept their unsubstantiated statements. I sympathise with Mr Fisher having to work with the archaic transfer system - poor chap, but genuinely, if he is going to try to lobby a change in the transfer system I can only congratulate him on that.

The FSA and FOS have shown themselves to really represent the 'retail client', once again we can proudly look at our financial system with pride.

I am off to train to become a full jedi now (or perhaps finish the JO exams....)

Anon 15 - WHY ARE YOU ANON? No courage of your convictions...I have noticed with this blog that anyone that mentioned anything even vaguely seen as defensive of Towry the vvenom begins.

Anon 15 are you an adviser - and do you charge commission I have dealt over the years with so many commission hungry so called expert advisers who are under qualified, or hide their real charges and then get all high an mighty about standards. Deceipt by another name.

I agree Towry could have done a lot better on this whole debacle but then again I also think there are a lot of vested interests out there too...and that is what is really fuelling this debate.

I read a lot of this rubbish so I rang Towry for a copy of their terms and conditions - and I still have my old EJ ones... try it, there is no difference??? So I get accused of distractions when in reality no one has answered my questions... as soon as I ask anything a little close to the knuckle for this so called campaign it all goes quiet.

I keep asking questions of Mr Simpson and no answers...still no answers. I think a lot of people will agree with me that Towry might have messed up, but at the same time there is clearly an agenda to Mr Simpson, he is not Robin Hood but he clearly seems to think he is. Sorry but it riles me that others don't see this blatant abuse of unsubstantiated claims.

Could not agree more Karen.. I read the Sunday Mail article and the same old Towry bashing anonymous comments are made under that article, with one interesting exception.

Karen.

Exactly, there is no difference. So why are Towry applying transfer charges on a standard transfer from one platform to another when EJ did not? Also, why when the circumsatnces are the same, are some clients charged these fees and others not?

Anon 10, 'why when the circumsatnces are the same, are some clients charged these fees and others not?'

Having been in business/jobs/life for a very long time, I would say it is probably the PIA factor. If you can complain well, sensibly, sometimes with humor, and without personal attacks or venom, you win.

If you just whine, you are a PIA.

But all of this is just a guess from personal experience.

The responses to this one are going to be fun.

So TCF is not a given, it depends on who you are. Not very TCF, but a possible explanation for what is happening